Thursday, April 20, 2006

An Open Letter To Warren Boroson and the Daily Record Readers

It seems I've struck a chord with Mr. Warren Boroson..

It's important to defend against liars

The 11th Commandment, so far as I am concerned, is: Thou shalt not suffer thyself to be Swift Boated.

If you permit yourself to be lied about without vigorously defending yourself, you are encouraging the perpetrator to lie about other innocent people, too.
...
Example: Someone named Grim has a blog that focuses on the supposed alleged bubble in New Jersey real estate, and he regularly lies about me. He has accused me of urging people to buy houses while I quietly unloaded my own.

It was a lie that I have in recent years urged people to buy houses.

In my column, where I can express my opinions, I have suggested that sellers sell and suggested that buyers not buy unless they are prepared to live in their new house for many years.

In news or feature stories, in which I may not express my opinion, I have quoted people worried about New Jersey residential real estate, such as A. Gary Shilling, as well as people who are not worried.

So, I defended myself against Grim's accusation that I sold my house while urging others to buy.

Apparently he was startled. He referred to my vehemence and to my "insults." (I had called him a liar and a creep.)

He quickly erased my comments, though. I guess he doesn't think it's insulting to accuse a journalist of double-dealing.


Warren says that I deleted his comments, which is absolutely untrue, they can be found here:

http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/01/warren-boroson-profile-of-real-estate.html

Anonymous said...
From Warren Boroson

I sold my house because I didn't need 4 bedrooms, and I think older people like me should live in an apartment, for safety. I STILL OWN ANOTHER HOUSE. Since selling that house, it has appreciated $100,000.I have repeatedly written about selling my house. Ain't no secret. In Kiplinger's, in my own column.I have conveyed various people's views in my column -- the view that house prices are poised to plummet, the view that house prices will level off. My own view, which I have written about many times, is: Sell sooner rather than later.By the way, if I'm a shill for the industry, how come I wrote a book called, How to Sell Your House Yourself?You guys are a bunch of ignorant creeps. And terrible writers! But you are hilarious. And I love the publiciity!

and here is another one:

Anonymous said...
LIAR, LIAR!

from Warren Boroson
By the way, GRIM says that I have urged people to buy houses now -- while selling one of my houses. That is a lie. I have told everyone what Jim Hughes of Rutgers has said: If you buy now, be prepared to hold on for 10 years.What a creepy guy this GRIM is!

As far as I can tell, these are the only two replies that Mr. Warren Boroson posted on this blog, to which I replied:

Nice to meet you Warren. We were wondering when you would stop by.
grim

You can read the rest yourselves. I don't mind being called names, god knows I have enough emails calling me names. What I don't like is that he said I deleted his comments. Absolutely untrue. I have only ever deleted 2 comments from this blog (spam aside, of course). One was due to the use of profanity, and the other was the posting of private information.

Mr. Boroson should have done some more research before stating that I deleted his messages. I did not. He was obviously mistaken, likely due to the fact that there have been a number of "Warren-Watch" threads posted on this blog. Everyone here knows this is an open forum. Anyone can post anything they'd like without fear of it being deleted or having their view oppressed.

Mr. Boroson, I expect an apology in print.

Caveat Emptor!
Grim

62 Comments:

Blogger grim said...

Here is a compendium of the Warren Boroson series:

Boroson on Morris County
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/04/boroson-on-morris-county.html

Nothing But The Truth..
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/03/nothing-but-truth.html

Warren Watch - Home prices set to fall
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/02/warren-watch-home-prices-set-to-fall.html

Warren Boroson - Profile Of A Real Estate Cheerleader (Continued)
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/01/warren-boroson-profile-of-real-estate.html

To Warren Boroson and Dominick Prevete
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2006/01/warren-boroson-profile-of-real-estate.html

Bubble-backer changes tune..
http://nnjbubble.blogspot.com/2005/10/bubble-backer-changes-tune.html

4/20/2006 07:52:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Excellent Grim!
Nothing clears away spin like the truth.

Sincerly, One Creepy Guy

4/20/2006 07:55:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Keep up the good work.

The media is biased one way or another. You post facts that no media outlet does.

Thanks for saving me. I nearly put myself into a F borrower situation by over paying for a house using a stupid loan. I would be a debt slave or bankrupt. I am forever grateful!!!

4/20/2006 07:56:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The 11th Commandment, so far as I am concerned, is: Thou shalt not suffer thyself to be Swift Boated."


He doesn't make a strong start, with the "Swift Boated" comment as that involved the word of 100 decorated veterans, who were all in agreement.

So right off the bat, this reveals much about Boroson.

4/20/2006 07:56:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thou protest too much Boroson!

4/20/2006 08:01:00 AM  
Blogger grim said...

If you thought the "swift boated" comment was in poor taste, you should read this:

More poor, middle-class will work past retirement age

Mr. Boroson starts with:

In College Park, Md., William Pratt works at a McDonald's. He mops the floor, wipes off tables, washes dishes, carries trash to a truck outside, and scrubs the toilets, sinks and floor in the men's room.

He looks, Beth Shulman writes, "like anyone's grandfather."

Pratt is 71 years old.

He eats mostly peanut butter sandwiches, along with coffee. He lives alone in a boarding house, and his rent is $140 a month. He's a month behind.


and ends with:

happen to be the exact same age as William Pratt, the McDonald's employee. I, too, have continued to work -- if you can call THIS working.

But I live in a high-rise apartment with 24-hour doormen and a pool, and I own a weekend home in the Catskills.

I eat out maybe eight times a week, and I have even started a club, the Wine Lovers, which meets once a month at an exquisite French restaurant to savor expensive wines.

I regularly attend concerts in Newark, Englewood and New York City. Last year, I vacationed in Africa, and this year, I would like to visit Spain. In short, I am living pretty high on the hog.


grim

4/20/2006 08:03:00 AM  
Blogger grim said...

Posted this in the another thread, I'll just post it here as well.

My identity is no secret, it has never been.

My name has been published many times, in just about every North Jersey paper, either through quotes or through stories about the blog.

Heck, I've even mentioned my own name in a number of press releases.

The bulk of North Jersey real estate journalists know who I am, and have my contact information on file. I speak to a number of them regularly. I was interviewed by a journalist from an NJ magazine this past Friday. She received my contact info from one of the above mentioned journalists.

And it's not just my name, my photograph was also published a few months back.

So while I prefer to use "Grim" on the blog, my identity is no secret.

Sincerely,
James Bednar

4/20/2006 08:06:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thanks Grim! -interesting I'm getting a 'server too busy' comment on some of your story links -- do you have text excerpts.

You should forward your post and this thread to poynter.org and cjr.org. Your interaction here is an outstanding exibit how columnists can get de-pantsed by bloggers when they don't practice what they preach (also an indication of how journalists are paying very careful attention to bloggers these days -- something that, like truth-telling about the bubble, was almost nonexistent in years past.)

4/20/2006 08:09:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Boroson is a spiteful, odd, little man...

http://tinyurl.com/rw58q

4/20/2006 08:13:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Alleged Bubble"

You gave yourself away.

4/20/2006 08:13:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The 11th Commandment?

Boroson, where do you get off considering yourself God?

...

That article really shows this guy's true colors, and they aren't pretty. I am more disgusted and apalled by him than ever, and I'm going to write to the Daily Record to inform them that I will not subscribe to anything that publishes this fool's biased, slanderous faux-journalism.

Boroson, not everyone on this blog agrees with Grim, but at least there is debate with civility. Your article was more childish than some of the worst posts ever seen here - and you presumably have an editor that let that slide by. Amazing and pathetic.

4/20/2006 08:16:00 AM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

I sem to remember a Warren article where he recommended buying about 2 years ago. Is there a place to find his old articles?

4/20/2006 08:23:00 AM  
Blogger grim said...

Can everyone here please email the editors of the Record. Please, I'm asking you to take only one minute to email the following individuals. I'd like to be given the opportunity to defend myself, in print.

Walt Lafferty - Publisher
wlaffert@gannett.com

Dennis Lyons - Executive Editor
dlyons1@gannett.com

Jack Bowie - Managing Editor
jbowie@gannett.com

and of course

Warren Boroson
wboroson@gannett.com

4/20/2006 08:58:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.dailyrecord.com/customerservice/forms/letters.htm

Link to submit a Letter to the Editor at the Daily Record for your convenience....

BTW, I know it may seem weird that I'm all defensive being that I'm a recent home buyer, but it just gets my goat that this guy wants to silence an opposing viewpoint just because it doesn't agree with his own.

4/20/2006 09:00:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oops that link didn't fit...here's the short version:

http://tinyurl.com/hckf2

or add ters.htm to the one above.

4/20/2006 09:02:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Double oops - sorry Grim, you beat me to it by 2 mins and I didn't notice!

(feel free to delete these last 3 posts)

4/20/2006 09:04:00 AM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

Grim,

Done. I subitted online.

Dear Editor,

The recent article by Warren Boroson concerning a blogger in Northern New Jersey has several misstatements and needs to be rectified. First of all he states that the blogger is anonymous which is patently untrue. His name is on the main page of the blog, James Bednar. Secondly, Boroson accuses Mr. Bednar of deleting his comments. It is also not true to my knowledge. If something is deleted it still remains as a "deleted by administrator" placemark.

I myself frequent the blog daily because it provides a counterpoint to most of the real estate news you find out there which up until recently has only been positively spun. If you don't decide to print my letter then please allow Mr. Bednar to clear up the misinformation that has been printed in Mr. Boroson's column.

Thank you,

4/20/2006 09:17:00 AM  
Blogger grim said...

Please take the time to email.

I really want to be given the opportunity to defend myself in print.

4/20/2006 09:36:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

pesche22 said...
look boys and girls the bergen record is a socialist news rag.


FYI,

It's the Morris Record.

m reynolds

4/20/2006 09:39:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

In short, I am living pretty high on the hog.


Gawd, how tacky.

4/20/2006 10:08:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Grim,
Ironically, his comments actually bring a lot more publicity and attention to this blog! Now that he will be required to write a retraction, even more free advertising!

Would love to see a recent poll concerning the nations distrust of journalists. His article would serve as a prime example of setting forth as truth baseless lies. Shameful!

I will also write on your behalf.

4/20/2006 10:45:00 AM  
Blogger grim said...

Thanks everyone..

In the process of writing a rebuttal..

grim

4/20/2006 11:47:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

reinvestor101 wrote:

"I indicated that I had a different view and was met with all sorts of name calling and cute little comments. I've never responded in kind"


That's a laugh! You've called most people here "commies" and "working for the terrorists" on many occasions.

You're not only a few cards short of a full deck, but dishonest as well.


reinvestor101 continues:

"I have maintained that calling for things of this nature is anti-american. I've been laughed at and have had to read parodies of our national anthem."

The horror! Welcome to America, land of the free, home of the brave, and the First Amendment.

4/20/2006 12:08:00 PM  
Blogger chicagofinance said...

REINVESTOR101 said...

Sir:

Please spare us the sanctimonious martyr routine.

You are welcomed to post here, and I for one, want to hear your opinions.

Don't hold grim responsible for all the content of external parties.

4/20/2006 12:22:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The new migration data released today show people are booking out of the Garden State.

RELEASED: 12:01 A.M. EDT, THURSDAY, APRIL 20, 2006
Domestic Net Migration in the United States: 2000 to 2004 — This report describes recent patterns of population redistribution within the country. Analysis focuses on net migration for different geographic areas, including regions, divisions, states, metropolitan and micropolitan statistical areas and counties. The report focuses on the post-Census 2000 period but also includes data from 1990 to 1999. Internet address: http://www.census.gov/prod/2006pubs/p25-1135.pdf

4/20/2006 12:30:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I read this blog because it contains the truth backed up by hard facts. These facts allow me to come to my own conclusion. Articles by Warren Boroson are more for entertainment than for making any kind of informed dicision.

These types of newspapers tell you what they want to tell you, not what is really going on. A lot of people are going to be ruined thanks to biased writers like Warren Boroson.

I'll be writing to all the editors.

Awesome blog Grim. Thanks for the facts.

4/20/2006 12:36:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reinvestor101 must have a vested interest in the real estate market either directly or indirectly that is why his posts have always been pro real estate.

He doesn't care about anyone but himself. He doens't care if you buy a house for twice what it is worth and then go bankrupt a few years later. He only cares about his own self interest not you and not the truth.

4/20/2006 12:48:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Lets see people leaving the state of New jersey, An out of control State budget, Higher property taxes, Health insurance out of control,Median Incomes Flat for 5 years, housing insultingly priced

Yeah i know thye ain't making anymore land.
Japan housing prices dropped 60% peak to trough. They ain;t making land there either. 75% drop in Hong kong.

But Housing never goes down in NNJ according to the vested interest types. NOT!

If you buy a house at these prices expect to be underwater for about a decade and at some point be down more than 25%. Okay you don't have to sell, but their are no guarantewes in life that you may not have to sell so be careful paying insulting prices.

4/20/2006 01:05:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Warren Boreusomemore

4/20/2006 01:10:00 PM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

Grim,

Would this consitute lible?

4/20/2006 01:43:00 PM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

I meant libel.

4/20/2006 02:09:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Chatham inventory going through the roof -- properties sitting 90+ days.


Chatham, 07928

DATE / TOTAL / UNDER 750K
3-Mar-06 / 85 / 15
8-Mar-06 / 87 / 17
14-Mar-06 / 93 / 20
30-Mar-06 / 104 / 28
6-Apr-06 / 111 / 28
20-Apr-06 / 122 / 35

4/20/2006 02:19:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

CNN:

Housing prices put Americans on the move

Residents are leaving high-priced markets in the Northeast and West Coast for more affordable places in the Sun Belt.

Long link:
http://money.cnn.com/2006/04/19/real_estate/net_migration_tilts_south/

Short link:
http://tinyurl.com/fyy7a

4/20/2006 02:25:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Another comment about Boroson...

He said himself in his own article "In my column, where I can express my opinions..."

Why is he not on the Op-Ed page? It's so irresponsible for the paper to publish his "opinions" as news.

4/20/2006 03:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

bwhahahahaha - hello folks, I'm the anon who penned the parody last night that offended the reinvestor101 troll. Can't stop laughing --if one is going to be a flag waver, one should know the words of our own national anthem.

What I parodied "My Country Tis of Thee"(and thanks bobby for the props).

Would suggest you disingage from his posts, unless he produces proof of citizenship.

4/20/2006 03:23:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry supposed to say "what I parodied was" my country tis of thee- laughing too hard to type

4/20/2006 03:24:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is hysterical, well worth the 2-minute read:

http://waiterrant.net/?p=129

4/20/2006 03:25:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"There's nothing wrong with [knocking down beautiful older homes] and charm is not lost. This is call progress--something this country has been built on."


So would you knock down the Lincoln Memorial and replace it with a 'modern' building with vinyl siding?

Don't want to stop "progress"...

4/20/2006 03:48:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"unpatriotic diatribe cheering for the downfall of real estate markets"


What kind of patriot celebrates that a great many low, middle, and high income families can't afford to buy a house in NJ?

4/20/2006 03:50:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And what kind of patriot mistakes My Country Tis of Thee for the National Anthem?

4/20/2006 03:55:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nothing has changed in the last 5 years:

* NY City has not moved

* No new NJ Transit lines built in North Jersey

* Salaries relatively unchanged

* School systems unchanged

* Commute times unchanged

* NY City job market unchanged (probably a bit worse with all the "outsourcing" of top jobs to India)

* Rents relatively unchanged.

The only thing that has changed, is the price of buying a house -- up 100%.

Buy into this speculative real estate bubble at your financial peril.

4/20/2006 04:09:00 PM  
Blogger grim said...

I just want to thank everyone for their support, but more importantly, for creating this community.

This site is much more than just what I post on the main page. It's the community in here, in the comments, that really makes the site tick.

I appreciate everyones contributions and comments. Yes, even yours REInvestor101.

This isn't some fascist community where we silence disenting opinion. Everyone is entitled.

I have provided my rebuttal to the appropriate parties at the Daily Record.

Caveat Emptor!
Grim

4/20/2006 04:24:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Thats not actually correct. The Seacaucus transfer station was finished, and the Hudson BErgen light rail was started."


Fair enough, but did the Secaucus Junction actually reduced commute times? Wasn't that just a pork project? Regardless, I don't think you could say a new train station in Secaucus caused houses in Summit, for example, to double in value.

The Light Rail benefits a few towns (Hoboken and Jersey City), but has minimal net effect for NNJ overall. (Also, there was a PATH train before, which still runs.)

4/20/2006 04:43:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why can't prices level off for a longer period of time? What evidence other than "it has happened befer" is there that the market HAS to correct 30%? And if prices level off and do not drop, then the ARM adjustments should be handled better by a larger number of people. I have to agree with the NJ is a new borough of NY argument, with the additional point that commuting is much easier than it was 20 years ago and further back. Yes, it is not any better than it was 5 years ago, but RE cycles takes a long time, and 9/11 was a catalyst to get families out of cities. I know its getting old, and I'll stop using it soon, but - you want to live in NJ? Turn out those pockets.

I'm not saying RE is going up anymore, just that it won't plummet.

4/20/2006 07:22:00 PM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

I will say it again. Sorry...

The remaining 30% or so that do not own a home are the interesting variable. (34% + in NJ) That is out side of those marginal borrowers of the last 5 years who borrowed on I/O or ARMs to get into a house.

NJ where njtransit serves is a borough of NYC as far as I am concerned.(I am a transpo planner so I speak with a little knowledge.)

4/20/2006 08:03:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The issue in last 2 decade has been that while Jobs have increased in NJ & NY, not much new housing has been built in that proportion."


Shailesh, right now there are almost 20,000 homes for sale in Northern NJ alone. There is no housing shortage.

The housing crisis began 5 years ago, not 20 years ago.

4/20/2006 08:13:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Regarding the "Frank R. Lautenberg Rail Station at Secaucus Junction" and the Light Rail in Hoboken...

For the sake of argument, let's say they are a minor (very minor) contributor to the local NJ real estate bubble.

That was just one of the 7 things I listed above, and the practice of corporations "outsourcing" top jobs to India probably makes any gain seen there a wash.

The fact is, nothing has really changed, only the price of housing.

The prices have gone up not because of "good schools," or "good commutes," etc, etc, because those factors have long been in play, and did not magically appear 5 years ago.

Prices have gone up because of low interest rates, and the availability of suicide loans from lenders.

The party is over, and the guests are slowly stumbling out the door.

In 12-18 months cash is king, and those $200K underwater as their ARM adjusts will be screwed, and ripe pickins.

4/20/2006 08:26:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reinvestor101 – you sound like Boroson…are you?

What’s with all the patriotic nonsense, I’m here to learn so I can make informed decisions in the coming years for my family.

I’d wish everyone would just ignore this thin dead air, leave it alone, it’s a shouting match to which there is no end. Really, it’s not helpful to me and I’m sure it's not helpful for others looking to learn and rise above the flat, stale news we’re fed on a daily basis.
Show us real data or leave us, find another forum to listen to your stale drone.

4/20/2006 09:28:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But I can bet that prices are not going back to 2001 ( or even 2003 ) level. At the most they will come down to 2004 or 2005 level."

Have prior real estate busts only rolled back prices one year? This would be the first.

This bubble pop will be worse than prior busts, because in prior busts people had 'normal' mortgages, and put 20% down. Today, people are leveraged to the max, with payments scheduled to go up, and home values going down.



"At the end of the day, NJ has to decide how much of housing they want to allow. I am not talking about McMansions here, I am talking about simple houses that a worker earning Median income can afford."

You mean like in 2001, when essentially the same number of houses existed in Northern NJ?

The problem is not number of houses, but the price. There are plenty of houses already built.

4/20/2006 11:54:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To add, as this real estate ponzi scheme comes to close, the flippers and "investors" will jump ship (i.e., sell at a loss, or enter foreclosure), and there wil be even more inventory of existing homes.

4/21/2006 12:00:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think the flippers are already gone. If they aren't they are renting out their places and holding tight.

4/21/2006 05:19:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

flippers renting their places out?

At what negative cashflow!!!!!

Good luck losing money every month and then the value of your investment starts sinking month by month.

4/21/2006 06:47:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shailesh,

How long have you lived in NNJ???

I left here 10 years ago, and came back to find massive portions of forests razed to the ground for gigantic house farms. Take a drive around Lake Hopatcong for instance, and you'll find scads and scads and SCADS of newer homes in the $500-$600K range. Or take a look at pre-existing homes for sale. In Jefferson Township alone (the twp Lake Hopatcong is in) there are 129 houses for sale UNDER $500K according to the GSMLS, 93 of which are under $400K of which a number is in the $250-350 range. I'm not saying they're not overvalued in today's market but still, these are not expensive mcmansions.

I dont' know why you think we need to clear cut the remaining trees in this state for more houses. That's been going on a furious pace. Stop focusing on where the houses AREN'T and take a look at where they already are.

4/21/2006 07:05:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Stop focusing on where the houses AREN'T and take a look at where they already are."


Well said.

4/21/2006 09:41:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But, for prices to go back more then 2 years is probably not realistic."


Was it realistic during the last bust? It happened. Are you saying people are better suited financially today with regards to mortgages, than the previous bust?

You can't be serious.



"I think NJ needs more denser more planned communities."

I don't. I would never live in a "denser more planned community," and want space between my house and my neighbor's house. People are willing to pay a premium for that space, it doesn't come for free (nor should it).

If you don't want to pay such a premium, there are already plenty of "denser more planned communities" in Hoboken, Jersey City, etc, for people such as yourself that aren't concerned with over-crowding, not having a yard, etc.

4/21/2006 09:49:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"So, lets say if 10 acre of open land is available, wouldn't it be better if town built a Townhouse complex for 500 families, than just 10 McMansion."


You leave out the middle ground. Putting good-sized houses on 1/3 acre, would give you 30 homes. Not everything has to be a "McMansion."

Many people don't want to live in an over-crowded condo complex.

Have you ever driven through Bridgewater township? It's one condo complex after another. That town is ruined in my opinion, and I'd never buy a house there because of all the condo developments.

4/21/2006 09:56:00 AM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

UnRealtor said...

Not everything has to be a "McMansion."

Actually it does. The developer is maximizing his/her utility by putting the most expensive thing the market will bear in that place if it is a single lot. Towns don't want modest affordable places. Condos and TH developments are fought against because it is assumed that the development will be a magnet for young families (read kids).

4/21/2006 10:25:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Metro, having 30 higher-end homes on 1/3 acre lots would be worth equal or more than 10 McMansions, no?

$500K x 3 = $1.5M
$1.5M x 1 = $1.5M

Should be fairly close.

As for condos, the problem with having "affordable" condos, is often the people who live in them, rather than just kids. I had a condo, in a solid town, and a crazy neighbor moved in with two daughters who may as well have been running a brothel.

Punks and noise at all hours (and I mean all hours), fist fights in the parking lot, police showing up at 4:00AM, the list goes on. This was a nice community before they arrived!

All the other residents were screwed. The condo board did nothing, and within a year, every normal resident in that building moved out.

I'll never go through that again. Imagine if that occurred during a housing downturn -- people would be stuck there with that madness.

Aside from that madness, architecturally, condos are an eyesore. Masses of vinyl siding, they all look the same, etc.

These are the reasons I would fight against condo developments, but I'm sure others may feel differently.

4/21/2006 01:35:00 PM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

UnRealtor said...

Metro, having 30 higher-end homes on 1/3 acre lots would be worth equal or more than 10 McMansions, no?

$500K x 3 = $1.5M
$1.5M x 1 = $1.5M

Should be fairly close.

Thats not my point. Maybe I should have explained it better. A developer often has to subdivide the property. (or someone else does and he buys it from them) When he goes to build he already has a big nut that he is paying interest on or that he is losing the opportunity costs of his money tied up in the land. Regardless, He wants to maximize his return. When he goes to build he will build on each of those parcels a house that is likely to give him a higher return. These days the appetite has been for big houses. which is fine. The old formula used to be 1/4 to 1/3 building material costs and $50K for the parcel. Both of those have gone up so what is a builder to do but make a bigger house that will throw off more profit.

4/21/2006 02:35:00 PM  
Blogger Metroplexual said...

Also a developer I g know has said why would I build a modest house when the effort to subdivide is the same. He is essentially paying himself less for the effort.

4/21/2006 02:37:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Don't take it personally. These is a debate, and only understanding other opinion makes it rich."


Nothing taken personally at all, just chattin'. Hope the reverse is true.

Have a great weekend, and stay away from those open houses!

4/21/2006 04:46:00 PM  
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5/18/2006 06:12:00 PM  

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